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Do I share a planet with these people? - Corrosive Shame
Therapy for Life
kneeshooter
kneeshooter
Do I share a planet with these people?
From http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4434136.stm

Male and female prisoners should be given free condoms as part of measures to
halt the spread of HIV and hepatitis in UK jails, two charities have said.


But the suggestion of free condoms for prisoners has been condemned by the right-wing Conservative Way Forward group.

Its spokesman Andre Walker told the BBC: "Most people who've been victims of crime don't expect prisoners to be going into jail and having sex and getting involved in relationships.

"I think it's entirely unacceptable and the encouragement of it is pretty wrong in the eyes of most right-thinking individuals."


So, what we should do is bury our heads in the sand, lock the doors and hope they all die of AIDS? Do these people have nothing better to do than enjoy making other people's lives miserable?

Putting aside the rights and wrongs of prison, surely turning a blind eye to this kind of thing is just stupid?

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Current Mood: annoyed annoyed

24 lies or Lie to me
Comments
maleficent From: maleficent Date: November 14th, 2005 07:35 am (UTC) (Link)
Well, it is a well-known fact that if we restrict access to condoms, contraceptives etc people will just abstain. Oh no wait...
westernind From: westernind Date: November 14th, 2005 07:55 am (UTC) (Link)

I might be doing a Queen Victoria here, but...

Condoms for female prisoners...? Unless there are mixed-sex jails, or they're shagging the guards? I thought lesbians were about the lowest risk group for HIV?
kneeshooter From: kneeshooter Date: November 14th, 2005 08:01 am (UTC) (Link)

Re: I might be doing a Queen Victoria here, but...

When I read that I assumed the (lazy) reporter was substituting the shorter word "condom" for "contraceptive". But I might be wrong.
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westernind From: westernind Date: November 15th, 2005 07:46 am (UTC) (Link)

Re: I might be doing a Queen Victoria here, but...

I think my point was that the condom is designed to fit over a part of anatomy not normally active in women's prisons... unless a range of sex toys is also being provided... now, if it were contraceptives being provided for home visits and on release I'd be less confused.
Suspect there is a disconnect between the original recommendation and the way it got reported.
From: rock_n_rollstar Date: November 14th, 2005 08:00 am (UTC) (Link)
that's ridiculous. by providing them with condoms isn't encouraging them to go and have sex with people, it's just giving them the choice to have protection if they do. noone should be denied that, whatever the circumstances. what if these people are only in for a few years, catch HIV/AIDs, then get out and spread it?

agh. people annoy me sometimes.
(Deleted comment)
gaius_octavian From: gaius_octavian Date: November 14th, 2005 09:22 am (UTC) (Link)
Err hang on a second... when did they introduce "co-ed" cells? Unless we are talking about Bubba and his cellmate in which case yeah, probably a good idea.
feanelwa From: feanelwa Date: November 14th, 2005 09:42 am (UTC) (Link)
Of course it's just stupid. It's CWF. My mother thinks they're scary and that's saying a lot.
afm13 From: afm13 Date: November 14th, 2005 09:56 am (UTC) (Link)
This is a big part of my "day job". I have just completed work on a toolkit for management of HIV+ prisoners on behalf of the UNODC. It's a fucker. Basically, most governments (led by the US) are loathe to admit that homosexual activity and drug-taking take place in prison, because it makes them look lame. And yet, I have worked in maybe 200-odd prisons around the world and I've not been to a SINGLE ONE without a massive heroin problem (for starters). It is universally accepted that about 25% of all new heroin addicts first become addicted in prison.

It's a timebomb and an uphill struggle.

One thing most politicians are too limited to realise is that diseases have no respect for prison walls, nor do they have respect for state borders. Poor prison health automatically equals poor public health.

The two countries in Western Europe who have the highest success rate in tackling HIV are Spain and Germany. Both have needle exchange, condom distribution, substitution therapy and bleach avaialble in prisons. Go figure.
ikkleblacktruck From: ikkleblacktruck Date: November 14th, 2005 10:28 am (UTC) (Link)
I think they ought to all be too bloody knackered after a day of hard labour to be thinking about sex! Prison is not supposed to be a soft option. Their lives are supposed to be miserable, ffs!
afm13 From: afm13 Date: November 14th, 2005 11:06 am (UTC) (Link)
Rape is not about sex. It's about power.
ikkleblacktruck From: ikkleblacktruck Date: November 14th, 2005 11:42 am (UTC) (Link)
Right - so a rapist is going to stop to use a condom?
afm13 From: afm13 Date: November 14th, 2005 12:37 pm (UTC) (Link)
As it happens, if they are aware of the risks of HIV and other blood-bourne viruses, yes.

Hence Spain and Germany having much more successful track records of HIV and Hep B & C management.

Trust me, I do prison health for a living.
ruana1 From: ruana1 Date: November 14th, 2005 11:08 am (UTC) (Link)
I find it very telling that this man claims to speak for 'most ... victims of crime' and 'most right-thinking individuals'. Well, I know I've been the one, and I like to believe I'm the other (although I doubt I am by his definition) and I don't have a problem. So how does he know? Did he take a poll before putting out this diatribe? (And exactly what proportion is 'most', anyway? 90%? 75%? 51%?)

Even setting aside his hubris, there's his apparent assumption that saying victims of crime don't 'expect' something is a good enough argument. Not in my book.
kneeshooter From: kneeshooter Date: November 14th, 2005 11:57 am (UTC) (Link)
Coming to dinner on Wednesday btw?
ruana1 From: ruana1 Date: November 14th, 2005 01:05 pm (UTC) (Link)
Sorry - can't make it.
(Deleted comment)
(Deleted comment)
feanelwa From: feanelwa Date: November 14th, 2005 10:25 pm (UTC) (Link)
I have a feeling they're hiding a lot of rhetoric that includes the phrase "family values" in the sense that really means "we should shoot the gay people and make women slaves again". I've probably eaten dinner with these people when I was a kid.
sixtine From: sixtine Date: November 14th, 2005 08:13 pm (UTC) (Link)
Ach, it's only the same as saying that sex education for the under 16s is wrong. No difference. If they don't know about it they won't do it. Anyone who uses the phrase 'most right-thinking individuals' must be questioned. So subjective and so incapable of definition.
ikkleblacktruck From: ikkleblacktruck Date: November 15th, 2005 07:20 am (UTC) (Link)
And yet so understood by all, really.

Whoever says sex education for the under-16s is wrong? Last time I checked, they all get it in year 6 - although parents can opt them out.
sixtine From: sixtine Date: November 15th, 2005 07:09 pm (UTC) (Link)
But I don't think that 'right-minded individuals' is understood by all. We all have our own understanding of it and everyone's 'right-mind' is different.

There are heaps of people who continually argue that sex shouldn't be discussed as a going concern until 16. My best friend went to an Irish catholic school where the only reproductive education they had was plant biology and all the anatony pictures and details were physically cut out of the text books. His school still has the same policy (he's a teacher now - but not there!).
load_of_flannel From: load_of_flannel Date: November 15th, 2005 12:42 pm (UTC) (Link)
Erm...I believe you can get Condoms free on the NHS.

Prisoners have access to the NHS on request.

They can already get Condoms.
24 lies or Lie to me